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第8章

laches-第8章

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LACHES:  Yes。







SOCRATES:  Tell him then; Nicias; what you mean by this wisdom; for you



surely do not mean the wisdom which plays the flute?







NICIAS:  Certainly not。







SOCRATES:  Nor the wisdom which plays the lyre?







NICIAS:  No。







SOCRATES:  But what is this knowledge then; and of what?







LACHES:  I think that you put the question to him very well; Socrates; and



I would like him to say what is the nature of this knowledge or wisdom。







NICIAS:  I mean to say; Laches; that courage is the knowledge of that which



inspires fear or confidence in war; or in anything。







LACHES:  How strangely he is talking; Socrates。







SOCRATES:  Why do you say so; Laches?







LACHES:  Why; surely courage is one thing; and wisdom another。







SOCRATES:  That is just what Nicias denies。







LACHES:  Yes; that is what he denies; but he is so silly。







SOCRATES:  Suppose that we instruct instead of abusing him?







NICIAS:  Laches does not want to instruct me; Socrates; but having been



proved to be talking nonsense himself; he wants to prove that I have been



doing the same。







LACHES:  Very true; Nicias; and you are talking nonsense; as I shall



endeavour to show。  Let me ask you a question:  Do not physicians know the



dangers of disease? or do the courageous know them? or are the physicians



the same as the courageous?







NICIAS:  Not at all。







LACHES:  No more than the husbandmen who know the dangers of husbandry; or



than other craftsmen; who have a knowledge of that which inspires them with



fear or confidence in their own arts; and yet they are not courageous a



whit the more for that。







SOCRATES:  What is Laches saying; Nicias?  He appears to be saying



something of importance。







NICIAS:  Yes; he is saying something; but it is not true。







SOCRATES:  How so?







NICIAS:  Why; because he does not see that the physician's knowledge only



extends to the nature of health and disease:  he can tell the sick man no



more than this。  Do you imagine; Laches; that the physician knows whether



health or disease is the more terrible to a man?  Had not many a man better



never get up from a sick bed?  I should like to know whether you think that



life is always better than death。  May not death often be the better of the



two?







LACHES:  Yes certainly so in my opinion。







NICIAS:  And do you think that the same things are terrible to those who



had better die; and to those who had better live?







LACHES:  Certainly not。







NICIAS:  And do you suppose that the physician or any other artist knows



this; or any one indeed; except he who is skilled in the grounds of fear



and hope?  And him I call the courageous。







SOCRATES:  Do you understand his meaning; Laches?







LACHES:  Yes; I suppose that; in his way of speaking; the soothsayers are



courageous。  For who but one of them can know to whom to die or to live is



better?  And yet Nicias; would you allow that you are yourself a



soothsayer; or are you neither a soothsayer nor courageous?







NICIAS:  What! do you mean to say that the soothsayer ought to know the



grounds of hope or fear?







LACHES:  Indeed I do:  who but he?







NICIAS:  Much rather I should say he of whom I speak; for the soothsayer



ought to know only the signs of things that are about to come to pass;



whether death or disease; or loss of property; or victory; or defeat in



war; or in any sort of contest; but to whom the suffering or not suffering



of these things will be for the best; can no more be decided by the



soothsayer than by one who is no soothsayer。







LACHES:  I cannot understand what Nicias would be at; Socrates; for he



represents the courageous man as neither a soothsayer; nor a physician; nor



in any other character; unless he means to say that he is a god。  My



opinion is that he does not like honestly to confess that he is talking



nonsense; but that he shuffles up and down in order to conceal the



difficulty into which he has got himself。  You and I; Socrates; might have



practised a similar shuffle just now; if we had only wanted to avoid the



appearance of inconsistency。  And if we had been arguing in a court of law



there might have been reason in so doing; but why should a man deck himself



out with vain words at a meeting of friends such as this?







SOCRATES:  I quite agree with you; Laches; that he should not。  But perhaps



Nicias is serious; and not merely talking for the sake of talking。  Let us



ask him just to explain what he means; and if he has reason on his side we



will agree with him; if not; we will instruct him。







LACHES:  Do you; Socrates; if you like; ask him:  I think that I have asked



enough。







SOCRATES:  I do not see why I should not; and my question will do for both



of us。







LACHES:  Very good。







SOCRATES:  Then tell me; Nicias; or rather tell us; for Laches and I are



partners in the argument:  Do you mean to affirm that courage is the



knowledge of the grounds of hope and fear?







NICIAS:  I do。







SOCRATES:  And not every man has this knowledge; the physician and the



soothsayer have it not; and they will not be courageous unless they acquire



itthat is what you were saying?







NICIAS:  I was。







SOCRATES:  Then this is certainly not a thing which every pig would know;



as the proverb says; and therefore he could not be courageous。







NICIAS:  I think not。







SOCRATES:  Clearly not; Nicias; not even such a big pig as the Crommyonian



sow would be called by you courageous。  And this I say not as a joke; but



because I think that he who assents to your doctrine; that courage is the



knowledge of the grounds of fear and hope; cannot allow that any wild beast



is courageous; unless he admits that a lion; or a leopard; or perhaps a



boar; or any other animal; has such a degree of wisdom that he knows things



which but a few human beings ever know by reason of their difficulty。  He



who takes your view of courage must affirm that a lion; and a stag; and a



bull; and a monkey; have equally little pretensions to courage。







LACHES:  Capital; Socrates; by the gods; that is truly good。  And I hope;



Nicias; that you will tell us whether these animals; which we all admit to



be courageous; are really wiser than mankind; or whether you will have the



boldness; in the face of universal opinion; to deny their courage。







NICIAS:  Why; Laches; I do not call animals or any other things which have



no fear of dangers; because they are ignorant of them; courageous; but only



fearless and senseless。  Do you imagine that I should call little children



courageous; which fear no dangers because they know none?  There is a



difference; to my way of thinking; between fearlessness and courage。  I am



of opinion that thoughtful courage is a quality possessed by very few; but



that rashness and boldness; and fearlessness; which has no forethought; are



very common qualities possessed by many men; many women; many children;



many animals。  And you; and men in general; call by the term 'courageous'



actions which I call rash;my courageous actions are wise actions。







LACHES:  Behold; Socrates; how admirably; as he thinks; he dresses himself



out in words; while seeking to deprive of the honour of courage those whom



all the world acknowledges to be courageous。







NICIAS:  Not so; Laches; but do not be alarmed; for I am quite willing to



say o

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