the memorabilia-第45章
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evil。＇18＇ Thus （he added） it is that a man reaches the zenith； as it
were； of goodness and happiness； thus it is that he becomes most
capable of reasoning and discussion。＇19＇ The very name discussion
（｛dialegesthai｝） is got from people coming together and deliberating
in common by picking out and selecting things （｛dialegein｝） according
to their kinds。＇20＇ A man then is bound to prepare himself as much as
possible for this business； and to pursue it beyond all else with
earnest resolution； for this is the right road to excellence； this
will make a man fittest to lead his fellows and be a master in
debate。＇21＇
＇16＇ Or； 〃and seeks by hook and by crook to do what is pleasantest。〃
＇17＇ i。e。 he becomes an animal 〃feeding a blind life within the
brain。〃
＇18＇ Or； 〃selecting the ore and repudiating the dross。〃 Kuhner cf。
Plat。 〃Laws；〃 v。 735 B。
＇19＇ Or； 〃draws nearer to happiness and perfection； and is most
capable of truth…disclosing conversation。〃 Cf。 Plat。 〃Apol。〃 41：
〃What would not a man give； O judges； to be able to examine the
leaders of the great Trojan expedition； or Odysseus； or Sisyphus；
or numberless others； men and women too！ What infinite delight
would there be in conversing with them and asking them questions！〃
（Jowett）。
＇20＇ For ｛dialegein kata gene｝ = ｛dialegesthai｝； cf。 Grote； 〃H。 G。〃
viii。 590。
＇21＇ Cf。 Plat。 〃Rep。〃 534 D； 〃Phaedr。〃 252 E； 〃Crat。〃 390 C；
〃Statesm。〃 286 D foll。
VI
At this point I will endeavour to explain in what way Socrates
fostered this greater 〃dialectic〃 capacity among his intimates。＇1＇ He
held firmly to the opinion that if a man knew what each reality was；
he would be able to explain this knowledge to others； but； failing the
possession of that knowledge； it did not surprise him that men should
stumble themselves and cause others to stumble also。＇2＇ It was for
this reason that he never ceased inquiring with those who were with
him into the true nature of things that are。＇3＇ It would be a long
business certainly to go through in detail all the definitions at
which he arrived； I will therefore content myself with such examples
as will serve to show his method of procedure。 As a first instance I
will take the question of piety。 The mode of investigation may be
fairly represented as follows。
＇1＇ Lit。 〃essayed to make those who were with him more potent in
dialectic。〃
＇2＇ Or； 〃Socrates believed that any one who knew the nature of
anything would be able to let others into his secret； but； failing
that knowledge； he thought the best of men would be but blind
leaders of the blind； stumbling themselves and causing others to
stumble also。〃
＇3＇ Or add； 〃'What is this among things？ and what is its definition？'
such was the ever…recurrent question for which he sought an
answer。〃
Tell me （said he）； Euthydemus； what sort of thing you take piety to
be？
Something most fair and excellent； no doubt （the other answered）。＇4＇
＇4＇ Or； 〃A supreme excellence； no doubt。〃
Soc。 And can you tell me what sort of person the pious man is？＇5＇
＇5＇ Or； 〃can you give me a definition of the pious man？〃； 〃tell me who
and what the pious man is。〃
I should say （he answered） he is a man who honours the gods。
Soc。 And is it allowable to honour the gods in any mode or fashion one
likes？
Euth。 No； there are laws in accordance with which one must do that。
Soc。 Then he who knows these laws will know how he must honour the
gods？
I think so （he answered）。
Soc。 And he who knows how he must honour the gods conceives that he
ought not to do so except in the manner which accords with his
knowledge？＇6＇ Is it not so？
＇6＇ i。e。 〃his practice must square with his knowledge and be the
outward expression of his belief？〃
Euth。 That is so。＇7＇
＇7＇ 〃That is so； you rightly describe his frame of mind and
persuasion。〃
Soc。 And does any man honour the gods otherwise than he thinks he
ought？＇8＇
＇8＇ 〃As he should and must。〃 See K。 Joel； op。 cit。 p。 322 foll。
I think not （he answered）。
Soc。 It comes to this then： he who knows what the law requires in
reference to the gods will honour the gods in the lawful way？＇9＇
＇9＇ Or； 〃he who knows what is lawful with regard to Heaven pays honour
to Heaven lawfully。〃
Euth。 Certainly。
Soc。 But now； he who honours lawfully honours as he ought？＇10＇
＇10＇ 〃As he should and must。〃
Euth。 I see no alternative。
Soc。 And he who honours as he ought is a pious man？
Euth。 Certainly。
Soc。 It would appear that he who knows what the law requires with
respect to the gods will correctly be defined as a pious man； and that
is our definition？
So it appears to me； at any rate （he replied）。＇11＇
＇11＇ 〃I accept it at any rate as mine。〃 N。B。in reference to this
definition of Piety； the question is never raised ｛poion ti esti
nomos｝； nor yet ｛poioi tines eisin oi theoi｝； but clearly there is
a growth in ｛ta nomima｝。 Cf。 the conversation recorded in St。 John
iv。 7 foll。； and the words （verse 23） ｛pneuma o Theos kai tous
proskunountas auton en pneumati kai aletheia dei proskunein｝；
which the philosopher Socrates would perhaps readily have assented
to。
Soc。 But now； with regard to human beings； is it allowable to deal
with men in any way one pleases？＇12＇
＇12＇ Or； 〃may a man deal with his fellow…men arbitrarily according to
his fancy？〃 See above； II。 vii。 8。
Euth。 No； with regard to men also； he will be a law…observing man＇13＇
who knows what things are lawful as concerning men； in accordance with
which our dealings with one another must be conducted。＇14＇
＇13＇ Or； 〃he is a man full of the law （lawful） and law…abiding who
knows；〃 etc。
＇14＇ Reading ｛kath' a dei pros allelous khresthai｝； subaud。
｛allelois｝； or if vulg。 ｛kath' a dei pos allelois khresthai｝；
translate 〃must be specifically conducted。〃
Soc。 Then those who deal with one another in this way； deal with each
other as they ought？＇15＇
＇15＇ 〃As they should and must。〃
Obviously （he answered）。
Soc。 And they who deal with one another as they ought； deal well and
noblyis it not so？
Certainly （he answered）。
Soc。 And they who deal well and nobly by mankind are well…doers in
respect of human affairs？
That would seem to follow （he replied）。
Soc。 I presume that those who obey the laws do what is just and right？
Without a doubt； （he answered）。
Soc。 And by things right and just you know what sort of things are
meant？
What the laws ordain （he answered）。
Soc。 It would seem to follow that they who do what the laws ordain
both do what is right and just and what they ought？＇16＇
＇16＇ 〃What they should and must。〃
Euth。 I see no alternative。
Soc。 But then； he who does what is just and right is upright and
just？＇17＇
＇17＇ This proposition； as Kuhner argues （ad loc。）； is important as
being the middle term of the double syllogism （A and B）
A。 Those who do what the law demands concerning men do what is
just and right。
Those who do what is just and right are righteous and just。
ErgoThose who do what the law demands concerning men are
righteous and just。
B。 Those who know what is just and right ought （and are bound；
cf。 above； III。 ix。 4） to do also what is just and right。
Those who do what is just and right are righteous and just。
ErgoRighteous and Just （｛dikaioi｝） may be defined as 〃Those
who know what the law demands （aliter things right and just）
concerning men。〃
I should say so myself （he answered）。
Soc。 And should you say that any one obeys the laws without knowing
what the laws ordain？
I should not （he answered）。
Soc。 And do you suppose that any one who knows what things he ought to
do supposes that he ought not to do them？＇18＇
＇18＇ Or； 〃and no one who knows what he must and should do imagines
that he must and should not do it？〃
No； I suppose not （he answered）。
Soc。 And do you know of anybody doing other than what he feels bound
to do？＇19＇
＇19＇ Or； 〃and nobody that you know of does the contrary of what he
think
